Oldshirt: Lessons learned being an OM

A series of posts from 2019 on https://www.talkaboutmarriage.com by user oldshirt.

Lessons learned being an OM, #1 - your wife IS the type and she does have the time

The first thing I was to make chrystal clear to everyone is there is no "type" of woman (or man for that matter) that is immune to or above having an affair.

If the conditions are right and the right offer and right circumstances come along, anyone can do it. I don't care how religious or pious or seemingly faithful and loyal your spouse presents herself/himself to be, if the circumstances are right and the offer is right - it can occur and it can occur very rapidly.

The thing many BHs have trouble with is their WW may seem very disinterested in sex or romance and may even seem downright asexual. But the catch is they may not be interested or enthusiastic in sex with THEM. They may be having hot, sweaty, breathless porn sex with their OM.

Another thing that shocks many BHs is the OM is often not a great catch in terms of being a BF or husband or father. He may not even be that good looking ( several of the BHs of my WWs were better looking and made a lot better $$ than me. One was in med school at the time and is now a very highly paid specialist)

MW are not like single women in terms of looking for mate vs hook ups. Single women have 2.75 x 10 to the 25th power of check off boxes that they need to check off before they will get serious with someone... and they have a field of countless men throughout the whole world to choose from.

A WW really only has a couple check off boxes for a hook up and those are - 'does he turn me on sexually?' and ' can he keep it on the downlow?'

If some dude can check off those two things - that is good enough. Remember, she already has the dutiful husband and father that has already checked off the 10,000 boxes at home. Now she only needs someone that makes her jay-jay tingle and can keep it discrete.

-Another critical thing to keep in mind is this process may not take a long period of time.

Single women may need to be wined and dined and have moonlight walks on the beach and deep conversations about dreams and goals and feelings and life-plans etc.

A bored and frustrated married woman who's life has been about balancing work and house and screaming kids for years may only need a wicked grin and wink along with some tattoo'd biceps and abz and she is now giving a BJ in the back parking lot.

It's critical to understand that trysts can literally take place in MINUTES.

I have had WWs call me and tell me that they will be at my house shortly and that they will only have 5 minutes... and they made good on that 5 minutes. One literally swung by my house after dropping the kids off at school and had to be back at the house before her husband wondered where she was. It happens that fast.

These were normal wives and mothers and people that you work beside at work and sing next to in church on Sunday morning. There was nothing outwardly unusual or anything that would give you an indication that she would be kissing the kids good bye in the drop-off lane at school one minute..... and getting filled up bareback by me a few minutes later.

...oh yeah, that brings up issue - condom use... no way. WWs WANT TO GET FILLED UP BY ANOTHER MAN'S SPERM - or swallow it. Or have it shot all over their face or ass or whatever.

I'll address that in another post, but affair sex is porn sex and beyond. It ain't pretty and it ain't loving or sensual or the stuff of romance novels. It is down and dirty and nasty and very high intensity and passionate.

So the come-away I want to make with this post is dispel the notion that some woman is to sweet and innocent or too religious or pure to have an affair. Church ladies are just as likely to take a lover on the side as the stripper.

All it takes is deadly cocktail of boredom, marital fatigue, a loss of a sense of sexuality in the marriage (ie swamped with work, kids, house work, stress, bills, etc ) a husband who sits on the couch playing video games getting fat or gone at work all the time, or a woman who just simply feels like she has lost her sexy and her sense of self.

...and then when Sven at hot yoga class smiles and winks at her and makes her feel attractive and sexy again, that rush of hormones and feelings of youth and vitality come flooding back in again.

It might take an argument at home over who picks up diapers next or it may take BH forgetting to drop off the permission slip for the field trip at school and suddenly Sven is there telling her how hot and nice she is and that only a first class Ahole that doesn't care about her would forget to drop off a permission slip and a few minutes later they are meeting up at the park a few blocks from the yoga studio.

I'm not kidding or exaggerating - that is how it often works.

There's no one that is immune or incapable.

And if someone has 5 minutes out of their day that can go unaccounted for, they have the time.

Lessons learned being OM #2 - harsh realities (Warning: TRIGGERS AHEAD)

The main thing I want people to understand from part 1 is that no one is immune and it can happen any time, any where.

There are a number of other things that I don't think many BHs/BSs can wrap their head around initially that people need to be aware of.

I am going to post a few of those as bullet points in no particular order.

-WWs do things with their APs that they don't do and may never do with their BHs. This may seem counter to all that we have been raised to believe, but WWs hook up with OM because the OM are NOT SAFE and are not nice guys. They are dangerous and threatening and that is what makes them so irresistible to WWs. WW don't worry that the house isn't clean enough for the OM and doesn't worry that she may appear loose or ****ty or promiscuous (he already knows that) She doesn't care that she appears to be a good mother to him. SHE DOESN'T CARE. When you don't care, that is when the wild animal comes out. WWs will indulge in kinks and fetishes with the OM. Do anal. Swallow. Beg for facials when he's getting ready to cum. Dress in slinky lingerie. Engage in various forms of bondage etc. She is not a wife and mother and pillar of the community in the church choir when she is in the OM's bed or the local No-Tell-Motel.

90+% of the time the WW has no aspirations or intentions of running off and marrying the OM. A lot of times she doesn't even like him all that much or respect him as a husband or father material and she doesn't care of he thinks of her as wife or mother material. She just wants attention and excitement and to lusted after and desired. She wants to be a wanton woman of ill-repute with him.

-Condom use is rare (and I only say rare because there are always exceptions to everything) When a WW makes the choice to cheat (yes, it is a choice) She WANTS another man's sperm in her and on her. If she's going to risk her marriage, home and family, it is going to be for the full experience and not some neat and tidy, watered down substitution. If you are forcing some kind of confession, she may say they always used a condom...but they didn't.

(this wasn't a WW of mine, but I do know a WW that would stuff a tampon up herself before leaving the OM's place and then throw it out the car window a few blocks from her house in efforts that her BH wouldn't notice if they got it on once she was home)

- which lead me to the fact that it is not uncommon for WWs to screw their BHs soon after the OM. While many WWs lose all respect and desire for their BH and their marital sexlife basically dies during the A,,, Other WWs get a wave of hormones and a spike in libido that carries over into the marital bed and some simply make a conscious choice to screw their BHs soon after the OM so keep the BH from getting suspicious or in case they get pregnant from the OM to keep the ultrasound from giving them away. Yes this really happens.

- the WW will have assistants, co-conspirators, affair-supporters and advocates for the OM. This is something that can be really hard to swallow as a BS, but many if not most WWs will have a variety of friends, relatives, coworkers etc that actually encourage and support the affair. Once a girlfriend of the WW sees Sven at yoga class making glances and sneaking looks at the WW, these people will encourage and egg-on the WW and point out Sven bulge in his yoga pants and his rippling biceps and how blues his eyes are and how golden his wavy hair is. They will also lie for her and be her alibi and her cover story.

Some times it gets darker yet and there will be close friends and relatives that simply do not like you and do not think you are good enough, and they will urge the WW to seek other opportunities and point out all your flaws and actively encourage her to hook up with others.

I speak from experience on this one. Essentially all of my affairs, the WW had cheerleaders and supporters of the affair. In one case, even the adolescent daughter of one of my WWs was encouraging the A because she did not like her step dad.

Not only that, but there are websites and hook up sites specifically for cheaters and even discussion forums likes this one that cater to cheaters where cheaters go for advice on how to find APs and how to not get caught and how to cover their tracks and how to pull the wool over their BS's eyes.

Cheating can become almost institutionalized.

-WWs are often "in love" with the OM but do not love them. In many ways it is the opposite of the ILYBNILWY that befalls the BH. What I mean by this is the WW often experiences a rush of lust and desire and sexuality that she may not have felt in years and for all practical purposes is "in love" with the OM in that her feelings are powerful and passionate.

But she realizes that he is not marriage/father material or she may realize that he will not commit to her or take her on full time as a partner.

So she anguishes in limbo for a long time and her emotions and psyche are being pulled in many different directions and she may turn into a bona fide basket case.

- Another bitter truth is if the OM is taller, better looking, makes significantly more money, has a bigger Johnson and is better in bed and has a more interesting exciting lifestyle AND he wants her full-time and makes her a legitimate offer to be with him... I am sorry but that isn't even going to be an "affair", she is simply going to pack up and go to him. Hyper-gamy is real.

I have personally seen this happen in the course of one weekend. I know two people that met at their spouses class reunion on a Friday night and by Monday they announced their plans to divorce to their families and moved in together within a few months once the logistics were sorted out. They are still happily married today 10 years later.

I know a couple other couples that met and the WW was packing her bags and taking pictures off the wall to move in with OM within a few weeks.

Most ongoing affairs the WW gets her fun and excitement from the OM and gets her support and security and stability from the BH and she works hard to keep from getting caught and to have her cake and eat it too.

But if she thinks the OM is "better" across the board and he wants her fulltime and makes the offer - she's gone and you can't stop her.

I've seen this again and again and this is also what happened with me and Mrs Old. We were hooking up on the down low for a couple months and we both decided we were each Bigger Better Deals (BBD) than our current partners and within the time it tool to work out the logistics, we were together and her XBF and my XGF were standing there wondering what just happened.

I'm sure I'll think of more later and will add as I think of it.

Lessons as an OM #3 The mind and motives of the OM

OK so there is a predator out there stalking your sweet and pure wife.

He haunts the local meat-market bar and dance club and he wear sunglasses inside the bar and has gold chains around his neck and his shiny disco shirt is unbuttoned showing his chiseled pecks under his wooly chest hair and he approaches your wife on her one night out to get away from the kids and uses a scripted pick-up line and offers to buy her some exotic drink and ushers her to dance floor to show her his disco moves right????

No. Just no. Don't we all wish it were that easy.

The reality is a lot more insidious and painful.

The OM is more likely to be someone in your social circle. Perhaps even someone you called a friend. It may even be a relative. Read these forums enough and I guarantee you you will read about someone's wife screwing their brother or best friend.

There's even a case here in CWI where the gal screwed her father in law (EEEWWWW!!!)

And affairs in the work place and on the co-ed softball team or running club or community group like the Lions or various PTA groups through the school or the kid's sports teams are universal.

So what makes a man hook up with another man's wife? Again it's combination of nature (we're all just slightly more evolved animals than wolves in the woods) relationship circumstances, his desirability as a man and a lover, his character and boundaries and how sexually assertive/receptive the WW is.

In my case as I said in my intro, I was not unusually handsome or charming or rich or suave? I was not a Playa' or pick up artist.

What I was was flirtatious, sex-positive and probably gave off some kind of vibe that I was DTF for discreet NSA sex. And not only was I DTF but that I would still treat women with dignity and respect and would work to please them and respect them EVEN IF they were cheating on their Hs.

Basically what it boiled down to is I did not have the personal boundaries that told me NOT to hook up with married women and I was game and was willing to make it good for them and be discrete about it.

Instead of promising that I would call the next day and that I would be a good BF or good husband/father and would be with them. I promised the opposite and promised that I would not interfere in their lives and would not try to be their BF and would not try to interject myself into their lives or meet their friends or family etc. I was their side piece because I offered myself up to be their side piece (I didn't use those words of course, but that's basically what it was).

I offered them fun, excitement, attention and orgasms without any strings or commitments on their end. They could come and go as they pleased.

If their H was at work too much that week and they felt neglected - Come you Youngshirt's house for a couple orgasms and some cuddles.

Bad day at work and coworkers pissing you off? Come to Youngshirts house and he'll listen to your gripes while he gives you a footrub and will only want a footjob in return.

Ovulation is kicking in and you're hornier than a billy goat and your H can't get it up? Youngshirt will pin your ankles behind your head and pile-drive you and fill you up to overflow.

Tired and frustrated and bored with raising 3 screaming kids and diapers and dishes piling up in the sink and miss your ****ty days of hooking up at the college-town meat-market?? Put on your lacey underwear, stockings and garter belt under your sweats and go to Youngshirt's house and be that dirty, nasty porno star that you can't be at home.

What should be the scariest thing here is that there wasn't anything special or studly about me. In fact I struggled and had a hard time with single women. Single women wanted things from me that I couldn't provide like being stable and mature and financially well off and most importantly monogamous.

WWs could be their inner ***** with me and I was OK with it.

But here's the thing you need to keep in mind as a husband... there are billions of me in the world.

Now some of these guys are going to come on here and say they WOULD NEVER get with a married women. Good on them.

But for every one of those guys, there are probably thousands and thousands who would.

You see for a guy that just wants to get some tail, a married woman is a lot easier and much less hoops and hurdles than a single woman.

Yes, I said it, married women are EASIER. They are easier and they ask much less of a man. All they ask for is attention, acceptance of their sexuality, your discretion and privacy and that you can actually get it up and get them off and then keep your mouth shut about it.

Now they will tell their girlfriends of course but they demand your discretion.

(side note: They will tell their GFs and then it's just a matter of time before their GF is scratching at your door. BTDT, true story)

That guy may be your married neighbor with all the kids (he probably hasn't gotten any since the last kid was conceived) It may be her boss (rank has it's privileges and women love the boss) It may be her trainer at the gym (he's making her sexy and beautiful again so she attaches him to her new horny hormones) and unfortunately it may even be your best friend or one of your close relatives (people form attachments and feelings with people they are around).

And as I mentioned in the other post, she may be getting hooked up with friends of her friends or even some of her close relatives that don't like you.

Unless she is some kind of groupie or actually working to hook up with a traveling rock star or pro athlete or something, it's rarely going to be one for those guys.

Its most likely going to be an average joe that is already in her social or work circle that is nothing special and likely is not as successful or stable or even as good looking as you.

What he offers her that you can't is it is ok with him if she is a dirty, nasty, horny $lu++ and he won't judge or condemn her for it.

She is dirty and nasty and ****ty with him because he allows her to be and he doesn't care how well she manages the house or takes care of the kids. Doesn't care that keeps her job or brings home a good check. All he cares is that she swallows and has a good enough time that she comes back for more.

Lessons of OM #4 - The proposition

In one of my other threads XXXXX asked a series of questions that basically boiled down to what was my batting average and how did I select the women and how did I take it from Point A to Point Z.

At first I should have mentioned this in my "Harsh Truths" posts but as I got to thinking back about it, I decided this deserves it's own post as this is a very important piece of info for people to be aware of.

How things got from A to Z is very difficult to answer with any degree of accuracy because the truth is - I didn't.

It's bit more complex than this but the bottom line is I did not proposition or make the actual offer to hook up - They did. Every single one of them.

Now lets back up, I did flirt and banter and make some sophomoric innuendos and such just like a million guys do every day to countless millions of women.

But when push came to shove THEY were the ones that made the actual proposition. I may have made a flirty comment or a sincere compliment or engaged in some lively, colorful banter...but then they were the ones that asked me if I'd like to go down to the river in the moonlight after work or obtained my phone number from coworkers or came to my house in the middle of the night.

One played the oldest school trick in the book and asked if I'd help her with an exam paper and then outright asked me if I wanted to be her boy-toy.

And in the case of Mrs Old, that was brokered and set up by a coworker of hers (remember me saying WWs have supporters and co-conspirators?)

The important take away here is I did not select victims. I did not plan and scheme and use PUA tactics (I don't think PUA was even a thing back then) and I did not seduce naive hapless victims with suave and underhanded charms and pick up lines.

It is critical that BHs and potential BHs understand that these were sane, sober, self-determined, sexually empowered, adult women making a conscious decision and being active participants.

They were not victims. They were not duped by a Playa'. They did not fall for sob stories or pick up lines. They were noticed and flirted with by an adult male that they found attractive and that they felt could scratch an itch discretely.

They did not think I was a BBD than their BH. Only one even asked if I would have her if she dumped her H (I bluntly stated no. She hooked up with me semi-regularly for another 3 years anyway).

The reason I think this is a critical point to understand is I do not think my situations were very unique or far from the norm. I think this falls into the 90th percentile of cheating wives. I think this is the norm.

I think this is the norm for the vast majority of cases and when WWs cry and beg and say they were taken in by hollow promises of a playa', I think they are just spinning yarns and trying to capitalize on the BH thinking that they are naive and pure of heart.

I may have made the initial flirtation, but every single one of these women could have rolled her eyes and walked away like countless millions of women do every day, day in and day out.

Instead something inside of them made them decide that on that day and that time, they were going to go for it.

Maybe there was something in the twinkle of my eye.

Or maybe I was just in the right place at the right time and said the right thing to the right person in the right manner and I sat on that needle in the haystack.

And it may also be a good bet that if I hadn't said what I said, that the next guy that dropped a flirt or compliment or a nudge-nudge-wink-wink would have had her in his bed instead.

 

What I learned as OM #5- Can it be prevented?

Before I get into my next installment, I just want to say thank you to everyone that has entered into the discussions and debates. I knew going into this that there would be some hate and disgust as well as disagreement and even some overt contempt towards me. I understand this is a sensitive topic and there are some raw emotions on all sides.

I feel like I need to make a little reminder that this is all from my perspective and my opinions based on my experiences and things I have picked up and seen in the decades since my experiences as an OM.

I do not claim be any kind of expert or that my experiences apply to all situations of infidelity and while one of my primary objectives was/is to warn that this can happen in seemingly normal and average households with seemingly normal and average men and women, I am not saying that ALL people will cheat at any one particular time or set of circumstances. Perhaps this is my own naivete, but I am deep down an old softy and romantic and I believe that most people go through their lives and marriages and never commit adultery, even despite some golden opportunities or even despite troubles in their own marriages. My thesis is that no one is immune or incapable and that we are all human and that it 'can' happen to us... even if we believe to our cores that it cannot. So please no more debate on if any one individual will or won't cheat.

So anyway moving forward, what do I as a former OM believe are some things that could have prevented those events from happening?

Well some things seem pretty obvious but from other angles not so much.

What makes this difficult is as I and some other posters have made clear throughout this series is that cheating is a conscious choice that people decide to do.

WWs do not simply fall into bed with other men do to magic pick-up lines or pixie dust or fool-proof seduction methods. They weigh the pros and cons, devise alibis and cover stories, make their interests and objectives known and then cover their tracks. That is all very conscious and methodical.

As such, if someone makes the decisions to hook up with someone else, other than chaining them up in the basement, there really isn't anything a pBH can do to stop it. The best he can hope for is he can foster an environment and marital dynamic where she is less likely to want to, and the risk would be too great to risk everything else for some NSA sex.

There are countless books and websites on "Affair Proofing" a marriage. Knock yourself out reading those and hope for the best.

What I will share however is what I see that may have prevented my WWs from dropping their clothes onto my bedroom floor. Again these are my experiences and perspectives and opinions only. This is not marital counseling or affair proofing.

1. Don't be a drunk, abusive, neglectful, lazy, fat, slob with ED/PE and not lift a finger to fix things or try to meet her needs.

   Well duh. But I'm telling you, it's for real. There are lots of dudes out there that once the ring is on the finger and kids are screaming and filling their diapers that check out of the relationship and delve into video games and couch surfing and getting fat. Don't be that guy.

   Here's the thing ,,,, Once Sven at hot yoga starts taking his shirt off showing his abs and giving her some special attention, she will start going through mental gymnastics and checklists and priority assessments to determine if it's worth the risks and to justify riding him like a big white horse in her mind.

   No one man can be perfect and completely fulfill all her wants and needs at all times. But don't give mental gymnastics and quest for justification any more ammunition than necessary. Always strive to make the risks greater than the rewards.

2. One of the most critical things any spouse (man or woman) can do is set very clear and firm, reasonable boundaries and then ENFORCE them. And by boundaries I mean things like how much contact with ex BFs or prior crushes, time spent with "friends" of the opposite sex (especially alone time even with seemingly innocent activities and projects) Boundaries on personal conversation and interaction. Boundaries on social media and late night chats. Boundaries on discussions with personal relationship and sexual/romantic issues. Boundaries on time and activities with girlfriends that are cheaters or cheater-sympathizers or single women that are out playing the field and hooking up with various dudes.
3. closely related to #2 but do not be afraid to confront and address boundary violations or incursions into the Neutral Zone. Address minor incursions and violations immediately so that they do not become increasingly bigger violations.
4. Set clear boundaries with other men and enforce them. Do not be afraid to confront other men that are behaving inappropriately with or around your W and make clear that their behavior and interaction is not appropriate with a married woman and will not be accepted or tolerated.

   Forum rules probably prohibit me from advocating violence or anything illegal and you do not want to run afoul of the law as that can also be used against you when looking for justifications to hook up with Sven from yoga. But one does not need to be PC when protecting your home and family. It is better to thought of as "controlling" (and yes, you WILL be accused of it) than to be cuckolded.

   Here's something I should have made more clear in my OM post, OM are in it for quick and easy NSA poon. If you make it difficult and complicated for them and give them consequences, 95% will scatter like roaches in the light.

   Do not be afraid to confront OM and make your boundaries and intentions clear.

5. Understand that women are no less sexual than men and accommodate their sexuality accordingly. Women's sexuality is different than men's and they have different triggers and launch sequences and their sexuality is more influenced and effected by other forces. But their sexuality is not "less." and they are not less horny, not less sexually responsive are not less enticed and tempted by variety and novelty than men.

   To that, don't be a sexual dud or stick in the mud. If you have ED/PE or any kind of performance issue, for the love of all that is holy, SEEK HELP and address it and work on it. Do not just sit and play video games and get fat thinking that you'll be able to get it up next week, next month, next year and all will be well.

   One of my primary WWs had a BH with PE (30 seconds max) and she came to my house anywhere from a few times a week to monthly or so for FOUR YEARS. He didn't even try so she stopped trying as well.

   The take away here is do not fool yourself into thinking that married women with children are any less sexual than men and so it is OK to be a lazy lover.

6. The reverse of that is do not think women are any MORE moral or ethical or sweet and pure and innocent than men. Women may have been socialized to be care givers and be 'nice' to people and they may be less prone to physical aggression than men. But they are no more moral, ethical or any less self-serving or less entitled or less likely to be crappy than men. If you smell a rat, look for a rat and the rat may be her.
7. Never never never sacrifice or abdicate your sexuality as a man for domestic comfort and stability. Yes, you will need to step up to the plate and clean the house, wash dishes, change diapers, do midnight feedings, patch the roof, mow the lawn ----- that is called being an adult and being a parent.

   But don't turn into the nanny and the maid. Quoting Athol Kay from "Married Man Sex Life" "women desire the lord of the manner, not the butler." Be a partner in domestic life but don't put your virility and sexuality and masculinity in the cedar chest with mothballs. Stay fit and firm. Dress sharp. Keep yourself well groomed and styled. And continue to date and flirt and show physical affection and words of love and affirmation and continue to be a sexual being. Don't put your sexuality on the shelf. Expect and foster a marital sex life even if there are kids and bills and leaky fawcetts.

Remain a fit and virile and sexually viable male. Don't hit on or overtly flirt with other women, but leave no doubt that in the event of her blowing up the marriage, that you will have other options and opportunities and that you can walk away and replace her.

I know that sounds harsh and I know I will get hate mail but I guarantee you that my WWs had no doubt that if she got busted that their BHs would be there rubbing their feet and begging them to stay.

They really had nothing to lost by riding me like a stolen horse because they knew their BHs were whipped and may yell and pout, but they also knew they would not leave and replace them.

Assuming a BH is not an actual abuser or chronically unemployed drunkard, nothing will stop a WW in her tracks faster than knowing he will walk away and replace her with a younger, prettier woman the moment she steps out.

Harsh and uncomfortable. But true.

Again, these are examples based on my personal experiences and not a comprehensive affair-proofing plan.

If my WW's BHs had done those things, I would not have stood a chance. Like I said, most were better looking and more financially successful than me. I offered fun and games with very low risk.

If they had offered fun and games but also had a high degree of risk, they would not have given me a second glance.